THE PARTY PARTY BOARDS FOR PARTY PEOPLE YEAH! - Which Was Worse?

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Chest Rockwell
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Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Thread Started on Oct 19, 2006, 8:00pm »

http://www.thefakelife.com/blog/2006/10/which-was-worse-part-3.html

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Alex
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #1 on Oct 19, 2006, 8:49pm »

I also own the Matrix box set. It's on my book shelf next to the Alien Quadrilogy. I'd say there's a 50/50 split in the Alien box set between great stuff (Aliens 1 & 2) and shit stuff (the rest), whereas the Matrix box set is more like 70/30, 70% of it being shite. I think that qualifies me as a dvd whore.

I think my vote goes with Episode II because, even though I dislike both films almost equally, there isn't a single frame of it that instills in me any sense of excitement at all. It just drones on for what feels like an age as George Lucas ticks the boxes of what he feels should be in the movie (none of it, if you ask me). The film then reaches it's "zenith" with the Clone War. I must say, I had a more exhilirating time playing Call of Duty 2 than watching this tiresome, over edited effects showreel. It also kind of annoys me that they decide to emulate modern combat photography simply because they can, even though that style is completely out of step of the look and feel of this and every Star Wars film. It's incredibly jarring and the choice seems to have been made simply because the technology affords it.

I still find the Matrix Revolutions interminable thanks to it's emphasis on one dimensional characters and amateur philosophy, but at least the Wachowskis can compose a beautiful shot when they're not preoccupied with Zion or slapping leather.

« Last Edit: Oct 19, 2006, 8:50pm by Alex »

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Phil
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #2 on Oct 19, 2006, 9:19pm »

Attack of the Clones. Hands down.

The thing that gets me the more I see it is how insulting it is. It's like Lucas intentionally set out to make a parody of fan expectations, with Yoda's fight scene being the prime example. I can just picture him writing the script and cackling, "Those fuckers will eat this shit up!"

Revolutions may not be a very good film but I can't summon up much hate for it. It's boring and ponderous, but Clones is bad on a whole other level.

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Brad
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #3 on Oct 20, 2006, 12:01am »

This is a tough one, but I'm going to have to give the slight edge to CLONES.

Revolutions is a ponderous, bloated mess of pseudo philosophy, bad acting, and poor plotting, but at least it doesn't have Baby Fett.

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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #4 on Oct 20, 2006, 12:27am »

Oh, no question, CLONES is the absolute worst Star Wars movie of the lot, and is a awful movie in its own right as well. NOTHING HAPPENS. You're pretty much in the same spot at the end of the film that you were at the start, except Anakin's missing a hand and Jango's missing a head. This leaves the bulk of the storytelling to REVENGE, an infinitely more competent film made less competent because it has to handle so much material that should have been done in this film. It sucks and damaged the third movie in the process.

Actually, I liked REVOLUTIONS in the theater (haven't seen it since). Aside from the cop-out ending, it's got some interesting stuff. A lot of Smith, which is good because he's a pretty cool villain. RELOADED is a total turd, though.

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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #5 on Oct 20, 2006, 1:59am »

I'll say REVOLUTIONS. CLONES is a mess for the most part, but there are still things in there I like. I can't say the same for REVOLUTIONS.

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Andrew
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #6 on Oct 20, 2006, 2:47am »

People think Reloaded is worse than Revolutions? You are all crazy, but you are allowed to bring your feelings about both sequels (and the entire prequel trilogy) into this - I wanted to choose one film from each and tried to choose the worst.

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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #7 on Oct 20, 2006, 2:49am »

From what I remember of them, I think they're both as bad as each other, but then I don't see any of the Matrix movies as much cop.

« Last Edit: Oct 20, 2006, 2:50am by admin »

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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #8 on Oct 20, 2006, 3:36am »

Quote:

NOTHING HAPPENS. You're pretty much in the same spot at the end of the film that you were at the start, except Anakin's missing a hand and Jango's missing a head. This leaves the bulk of the storytelling to REVENGE, an infinitely more competent film made less competent because it has to handle so much material that should have been done in this film. It sucks and damaged the third movie in the process.

That's very true, but I think it speaks for TPM as well. There's very little in both those movies that really factors in when it comes to the third picture, which is why SITH feels so compacted, because it has to do everything which the first two movies failed to do. It also helps that there''s actual interesting stuff happening for once, instead of trade disputes and caterpillar assassinations.

« Last Edit: Oct 20, 2006, 3:37am by admin »

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Luca
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #9 on Oct 20, 2006, 5:00am »

This is a toughie. They're both deadly boring with a minimum of cool stuff mixed in. I'll say Clones, cuz I just love Smith too much.

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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #10 on Oct 20, 2006, 5:54am »

No question at all. CLONES. Revolutions, at the very least, is trying to be more than a demo reel. Plus, The Matrix flicks still work for me whereas the prequels have ruined even the original trilogy. Yep, even Empire.

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Greg
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #11 on Oct 20, 2006, 6:22am »

I know for a solid-gold fact how this one is going to go, but I have to vote for Revolutions.

I actually came out of the original theatrical run of Clones really liking it. The months that preceeded the DVD release, free from the effects onslaught, brought my opinion down considerably. And, as Lucas has said, Sith had to carry about 60% of the trilogy's story, leaving the first two with little to do but waste time. Still, I enjoy Obi-Wan's detective story, and Anakin's stuff once he reaches Tatooine.

Revolutions, on the other hand, bored me to near-suicide until the final Smith-Neo showdown, which I still consider one of the best super-fights ever made. Sadly, it's just too little too late, and I was completely out of good will by that point.

The movie comes across like the cute girl at the party who turns out to be a philosophy major, and can't shut the hell up about it, as if she's the first person to discover these things. You really want to be interested, because you'd really like to bang her, but god damn it, is she irritating. Then you go home unsatisfied and masturbate while fantasizing about how she should have been.

But maybe that was just me.

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Alex
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #12 on Oct 20, 2006, 6:24am »

Greg, that story touched me in ways I never thought possible from someone other than a philosophy major.

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Andrew
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #13 on Oct 20, 2006, 6:27am »

Andrew Clarke BA (Hons) Phil ;_;

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Brad
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #14 on Oct 20, 2006, 6:42am »

We forgive you, Andrew.

Just don't let it happen again.

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Luca
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #15 on Oct 20, 2006, 6:44am »

That cute girl at the party sounds like me only I'm not cute nor a girl and you should replace philosophy with Spidey and also nobody ever wants to talk to me.

'cept you guys, rite rite?

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Andrew
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #16 on Oct 20, 2006, 6:49am »

I don't want to stick my dick in you, Luca, but I'll happily talk spidey. Those big kids hogging the bathroom and talking really fast and loud scare me. And Stacy told me I was a lame-o.

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DeathSurge
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #17 on Oct 20, 2006, 7:14am »

A semi-unfair comparison, as Revolutions was the final chapter to a trilogy so obviously had a lot more riding on it compared to Clones, and was thus a bigger let down. But as much as I was dissapointed in Revolutions, I have to go with "Clones" being the far more awful film. It's just so flimsy and horribly acted. As boring as "Revolutions" became in parts, at least there was a sense that the actors were trying to make the best of it. The entire prequel run managed to take Portman, an otherwise interesting actress, and made her appear to be performing only because she was extorted by Lucas holding incriminating nude photos of her and donkey.

I'll shamely admit to liking the Yoda fight (He's a Jedi Master - about fucking time he threw down) but that was the only thing acceptable in that mess of a production.

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Alex
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #18 on Oct 20, 2006, 7:20am »

The Yoda fight was like watching a burly chap slam a pinball machine until it said 'tilt'.

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Luca
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #19 on Oct 20, 2006, 7:25am »

Quote:

The entire prequel run managed to take Portman, an otherwise interesting actress, and made her appear to be performing only because she was extorted by Lucas holding incriminating nude photos of her and donkey.

AND IT'S ONLY A MATTER OF TIME BEFORE SHE SLIPS UP

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Crow
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #20 on Oct 20, 2006, 8:29am »

I'm voting Clones but...well...there's no way for me to come out of this unscathed arguing one way or another, but I'll go for it anyway: despite mountains of bullshit in them, I actually rather like both films.

Revolutions shares many of the complaints I had with Godzilla last round. It's dull as fuck for stretches at a time when a universe that has such an awesome playground like The Matrix itself can easily sustain more interesting stuff than Roland Rain Man-ing the word "goddamn" for 45 minutes. But regardless, all of Neo's material is strong (especially the scenes with Rama Kandra), Smith is ALWAYS great, some of the secondary characters actually come off as likeable (in particular, Mifune), the fight with Bane is a shockingly cool, brutal change of pace, and everything from the Superbrawl onward is gold for me. It's just you have to deal with some cinematic Valium getting to that stuff.

Clones has no such rewards waiting for the patient. There's stuff I love: everything involving Obi Wan, everything involving Yoda (more the scene with the younglings than the thin-line-between-badass-and-dumbass fight), everything on Tattooine (even Anakin in whiny emo bitch mode), Count Dooku, everything from "No I'm taking him NOW!" onward. In between all that, however, is some of the worst executed stuff in the prequels, stuff that taints the series from then on. While there's interesting material, in the end, it's a pointless film, redeemed only by the fact that The Clone Wars series picks up this movie's slack in a way it never should've had to. Revolutions, dull as it may be, never forgets its goal.

Revolutions bad stuff puts you to sleep. Clones' bad stuff is cinematic cancer.

Clones is worse.

^{(P.S.--I still think it's better than Phantom Menace.)}

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Brad
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #21 on Oct 20, 2006, 8:32am »

I remember my dad watching the Jango/Obi-Wan fight, and it was the funniest thing. He got so frustrated by the utter idiocy of the scene that he began shouting at the television.

"Obi Wan is a fucking JEDI! Why doesn't he just MAGIC this moron into the ocean?"

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Andrew
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #22 on Oct 20, 2006, 8:38am »

Because forcepush is the path to the darkside! All Jedi must take a sacred initiation oath to be boring pussies. The prequels tell us this.

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DeathSurge
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #23 on Oct 20, 2006, 8:56am »

Quote:

Because forcepush is the path to the darkside! All Jedi must take a sacred initiation oath to be boring pussies. The prequels tell us this.

That's where Lucas's attempted rip from eastern martial arts philosphy is almost (but not quite) as flawed as the pathetic "You must not fight back" philosphy in Berry Gordy's "The Last Dragon".

Spirtually centered calmness and focus is important to martial arts because anger causes mistakes in fighting techniques, not because it's against a morality code. Fighting was/is an accepted necessary breach of the 1st moral precept of Buddism. Hollywood always couples martial arts and buddism as a single concept from it's eastern roots, but many fighting techniques violate all fair play rules because it's effective.

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Andrew
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #24 on Oct 20, 2006, 9:21am »

Then again, The Wachowskis interpreted Eastern spiritualism as clinical depression and getting skullfucked by mechanical tentacles.

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Phil
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #25 on Oct 20, 2006, 9:26am »

Quote:

And, as Lucas has said, Sith had to carry about 60% of the trilogy's story, leaving the first two with little to do but waste time.

That's a cop-out on Lucas' part. He had full creative control to do whatever he wanted with the prequels and to spread out the story however he wanted. That bullshit quote about Sith having to carry most of the story is just his typical MO of trying to deflect criticism. The same way he claimed that Clones wouldn't be as successful as TPM because people wouldn't be interested because it's mostly a love story. Or how Sith wouldn't be as successful because it was going to be such a dark movie. Or how the upcoming Indiana Jones 4 (if it ever gets made) might disappoint fans because it's not what they're expecting.

Hey dickhead - stop trying to second guess your fans and just work on writing a good fucking script. If the movie is good, fans will be happy.

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DeathSurge
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #26 on Oct 20, 2006, 10:04am »

Quote:

Then again, The Wachowskis interpreted Eastern spiritualism as clinical depression and getting skullfucked by mechanical tentacles.

But tentacle porn is always entertaining. Emo musings on existance however....

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Alex
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #27 on Oct 20, 2006, 10:12am »

I'd rather watch emo musings on existence than emo whining about how "EVERYBODY'S AGAINST ME"! At least with the former there's some entertainment to be had by watching them scurry around their rat's maze of a brain, feebly pushing philospohical teachings together as the die hard fans furrow their brows in a vain attempt to understand things.

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Doug
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #28 on Oct 20, 2006, 10:33am »

The best thing Reloaded did was fool a bunch of geeks into thinking it actually had something to say.

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Andrew
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Re: Which Was Worse? - Part 3
« Reply #29 on Oct 20, 2006, 10:54am »

Reloaded was undermining the manicheanism of the first entry. Loads of fun for the whole family. The film's problems lie elsewhere.

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